Mills Vautrot
Teach people that it matters what they think. The organization is structured to be trustworthy in the fact that if we say, if you've got a problem, bring it to us. We wanna get it resolved. That you do every time,
Kristiana Corona
Ever feel like everyone else has leadership figured out, and you're just making it up as you go? I've been there. I spent two decades leading design and technology teams at Fortune 500 companies, and for years I looked like I had everything pulled together on the outside, but on the inside, I felt burned out, overwhelmed, and unworthy of the title leader. Then a surprise encounter with executive coaching changed my life and dramatically improved my leadership style and my results.
Now I help others make that same shift in their leadership. This podcast is where we do the work, building the mindset, the coaching skills, and the confidence to lead with clarity and authenticity, and to finally feel worthy to lead from the inside out.
Kristiana Corona
Hey Mills, I'm so glad that you could join us today. Welcome to the Worthy to Lead Podcast.
Mills Vautrot
Awesome. Thanks so much. I'm really happy to be here. I've been thinking about it all week. I've been very excited.
Kristiana Corona
I love that. So. We're so glad to have you here. I wanna jump right in and start talking about things that are gonna be important on people's minds. So I would love to hear just a little bit about your journey and how conflict resolution came to be part of your leadership and your coaching work.
Mills Vautrot
Well, the, my background is mostly been small companies doing operations of one kind or another. Everything from commercial building product sales to commercial building services, to home services, to regional economic development, to IT services for big companies, and the last 14 years or so, medical devices.
But all through that process, I used everything that I do, and I also now have for several years now done. Consulting with strategic, strategic change partners. Easy for me to say. And the part about the conflict, right? The simple way of saying it, I guess, is I really, really, really just love people. I just do it is people to me are this amazing resource, this amazing tapestry of just abundance and just things I could just sit and be with all day.
And one of the things that I saw. Was that the amount of conflict and stress and friction and just, ugh. When there were problems in the workspace left, people just drained by the time they got home, there was nothing left of them to give to the things they really love in this world. Their family, their communities, their projects and charities, and whatever.
They were just burnt by the time they got home. I didn't like that. And I kind of started looking for what could actually make a difference in that. And that's kind of how I got here.
Kristiana Corona
There are so many people that are suffering, and you see that suffering and you found this unique way to add value to help them be present for their families, to help them have more energy, more space within their work. I love that.
Mills Vautrot
Yeah. Thank you. You said it better than me. That was really good.
Kristiana Corona
You mentioned before that you've had several wonderful teachers, and one of those wonderful organizations that taught you was Landmark. Can you tell me a little bit about that experience? 'Cause I know that experience isn't necessarily a walk in the park either.
Mills Vautrot
Yeah. Landmark Education. They've been around since the seventies, and they are incredibly rigorous. They are just. Boy, there is no wiggle room in what they do and the way they teach and the points they're trying to get across. And a lot of it revolves around language dynamics and how that can make a difference in your life.
And also kind of like a great amount of work on where do you stand in something, right? You're kind of like better way to say standing is when people think about, I'm gonna plant a flag about this. I'm gonna produce these kinds of results, and I'm gonna, and my, that's my commitment. My declaration is I'm gonna do that in a way that actually serves the people and doesn't just burn them out.
And so that was a lot of work. For me, particularly, 'cause I just, I'm from rural southern Louisiana, uh, and thinking about those kind of things and performing a practice around them, that was a whole another planet for me. And so it took a lot of work, a lot of years, but I was thrilled with the results that I got from it.
Kristiana Corona
Can you just talk about the, like the. You mentioned the sensation, the, the stress, the chaos, the noise. Everyone's running around with their hair on fire. All of these things are happening, and you have to be that calm presence throughout all of that and be clear about what are we accomplishing and, and help people get to that point. Tell me a little bit more about, about that.
Mills Vautrot
Being in the middle of that. Everybody's here on fire and I need to be the calm center of it. Right. Well, it's, it's funny you mention that in particular because one of the things I did with them is I, I volunteered for about 10 years, alright. Of seminars from as small as 20 or 30 people on a Wednesday night, just kind of weekly thing to a massive event with 500, 800 people showing up and you've got a whole team.
Things aren't going well and who's gonna manage it, right? It was, you know, saying, well, we did our best was not gonna ever fly. And so what you learned was to watch for the people in the space, right? Yes, there's a timeline and yes, there's things that need to get done. And being that calm center was really a process of being able to look at everyone and see where their capacities were realistically.
Then guide them to what can they do effectively? And there's pressure because the people are coming in, and the thing starts in 10 minutes, and oh my goodness. But if you hand them something that they know they can get done, they go have that win, man. They get it done. And there's a shared commitment. That particular organization is really big about the shared commitment.
You meet with the team before you guys are, get really grounded, really clear. They kind of communicate out whatever they need to so that they're totally present. And then they go into the space and then they're gonna be a human while they're there. So, you got being with them and watching them, and that's been incredibly effective in those kinds of situations and in the workplace as well.
Kristiana Corona
I love how you talked about being present and looking for the. Like what is happening with the other people in the room? Like first of all, you have to get yourself under control, your own mental fires or alarms or fears, concerns in order to be present for others, and then be able to kind of scan the room and say, who is it that needs to get what done? Are they capable to do that right now? I'm curious, you mentioned also like that creates growth within a relationship when you can learn how to do these things. Can you just unpack a little bit more what that relationship-building piece looks like within this practice?
Mills Vautrot
Absolutely. That's, it's actually one of my very favorite pieces, and when you're faced with a conflict of some kind, whether it's you and somebody else, or you're kind of mediating it, whatever that looks like, in order to get to the other side of it.
You're going to have to learn something more about everybody involved, especially if it's a you and someone else, and you're going through that conflict resolution process. It's impossible to get to the other side without becoming more vulnerable, becoming more educated on who they are and what actually matters to them in this world, and being able to stand shoulder to shoulder and look at something that seems unfixable.
In the moment and fix it and get creative and come to the other side of it, and then agree that that's a fix. And agree to keep checking in to see what else pops up as we go along because we're now beginners in this part of the process,
Kristiana Corona
It seems like a lot of people avoid conflict because they're afraid that it will irreparably damage the relationship. Right. Well, it's, it's too scary to bring up this or that thing, or where my values have been violated, or where I felt like I was let down because the other person is not gonna wanna be in relationship with me because. Of X, Y, Z. And so therefore I should just avoid it or steamroll or not build that relationship in the first place because I know we have to have conflict and now, you know, gotta work through that armor we have to build in the corporate setting.
And what you're saying is kind of the complete opposite. It's like with the right tools, you can confidently enter into a situation where it might be a conflict at the beginning, or it might be an unresolved situation and know that at the end of it. Not only are you gonna get a resolution, but you might even get a stronger and better relationship as part of that too.
Mills Vautrot
Absolutely. That is exactly how it works. And I think you said, you pointed to the thing really great is like it's having the confidence in that tool and knowing that the work works is, I hear that, I've been hearing that for 35 years, but work works, right? It's the. And you may need to see that. You may need to hear from other people that have gone through it or whatever kind of validation and credibility you wanna build on it.
But if you can believe that this process is actually gonna get the job done, it's a lot easier to take that step forward. And I have so much respect for people who are willing to step past that thing. It is not simple in the beginning, and it takes courage to take that risk and to trust when you're going through it the first time.
So, yeah, sometimes you need a hand, uh, somebody, you know, a little guide through a little extra help. That's. Absolutely appropriate.
Kristiana Corona
And I feel like there's probably a lot of unlearning that needs to happen first, which is I may have thought this is how conflict should have been handled. This is how I was raised, or this is what I've seen in the workplace from others.
And so, therefore, I think that's how conflict is handled. But it doesn't resolve, it doesn't end well. It doesn't end with relationship building. It ends with a lot of, we may have accomplished a goal, but. Someone lost along the way, and they lost big, and you know, now there's damage and there's repairs that need to be made.
Kristiana Corona: And, and so that process of, okay, maybe what I've learned up until this point, I need to unlearn some of those behaviors before I can, can even move forward with here is something that will work and have trust in that process.
Mills Vautrot
Absolutely. It is critical. But yeah, it is a bit of relearning. It is a bit of resetting expectations. It is a bit of getting some agreements even before we start the process so that we're all really clear. And so, absolutely.
Kristiana Corona
So I'm gonna walk through just the high-level framework and talk about kind of the steps that are in this seven-step process. And then I'd like for us to really dive deep into each one, and you can kind of tell me more context and, you know, share any stories or things like that come to mind.
And I feel like a lot of this mimics the benefits of coaching and so as we think about coaching behaviors around listening and mirroring and understanding and, and you know, being aware of emotion or blockers or things like that, there's a lot of similarities in the skill sets and the skill building around this, and that's why I am so fascinated by it.
So I'm gonna just quickly run through the framework, and then we can jump in. Alright, so the acronym for these seven steps is B, the leader. So it starts with B, which is around being prepared the leader portion. So L for leader is around listening and learning more, especially about concerns and unmet needs.
The E is about exploration, so exploring possibilities, exploring the unknown. A is asking if you listened accurately. D. Discover. So what are some of the standards that have been violated or the values, the things that each party brings to the table? Really understanding those in depth, E is evaluate. So what is a standard of operation that will work for both parties?
Like, what's it gonna take to get those things into sync? And then R, the last R in leader is about a request for future action and resolution. So let's go back to the beginning with B, around be prepared. And I know you started to talk a little bit about this. Tell us what that means in this context.
Mills Vautrot
Absolutely. And before I do that, I wanna jump in with one extra little piece, which is inside of the context of what we're doing. We use the five speech acts. Right in our methodology, pretty much everything that's said or thought will fall into one of five categories. An assessment like you're describing something, a declaration, you're saying, this is who I am in the matter.
This is how this is going to go. You're declaring it a request, an ask of any kind or nature, an offer, something that's being proffered without request, and a promise. Any kind of an agreement, any level of agreement, whether ironclad or just kind of a general agreement, it's cultural agreement or whatever those five categories.
So those would be important as we move through the process. With regard to B, the most important piece about the B is really getting yourself clear, right? You don't do this process when you're angry or upset or act reactivated or whatever. You do this process when you're very, you've cleared out everything.
You're very calm, you're, you've made a declaration for yourself that there's more to articulate and bring forth here. There's more to learn here. This is my stand in the matter that I am going to avoid making assumptions and I'm going to listen and be present really. One of the most powerful things you can do.
Because a lot of times, even people that are experienced in this, right, will, somebody comes in, ah, you're gonna have body sensations, right? You're gonna have, maybe your stomach will get knotted up, maybe your chest will get tight, maybe your throat will get tight. It's really important and incredibly useful to articulate that.
Wow, my, my throat's really tight. My stomach when he said that, my stomach or she said that my stomach got all knotted up and really. Keep working on being present in your body until you can tell that your body's relaxed. You can tell that you know what your goal here is. You are clear that you've written down what you want to get out of this.
Don't share it yet, but you've written down what a good result for you would be. So you have a sense of where you'd like to see things head. I'm actually having both parties do this. So it's not just the facilitator. Both sides.
Kristiana Corona
That's what I was gonna ask. Is it, is it one sided? What if the other side is still on fire? Are they?
Mills Vautrot
Yeah. No, no, no. Both sides. Everyone's gotta calm down. Yeah, everybody's gotta calm down, you know, write down your concerns, and just really kind of get all of that punchy upset. Why can't they do what I want? You know, all that stuff. Get it out. Write a lot of it down. Be clear about what's going on with your body.
What's your concern that's not being addressed here? What your optimal outcome?. And look at everything. And then schedule and time that's gonna, you can both have at least an hour to sit and go through this first part of this process, 'cause you may get to the very end of it. In one setting, you may not.
And then when you come into the meeting, it's, thank you for taking some time to assist us with me with understanding this issue. I call this meeting to learn more about this situation and how we can work together. Right? You wanna start the meeting with a possibility, not like a problem that we're dealing with, right?
And then describe the meeting this, the issue in factual, observable language on this day. This document was provided. I expected it to be at, it was provided at noon. It was provided at 4:00 PM that held back me doing these four things. And that outcome of that consequence of that was that this happened.
You weren't a bad person. You are, whatever. This is what happened. And one of the most critical pieces is to say, to really precedents, to really kind of set expectations that. This resolution that we're out to achieve, it's probably not gonna go all your way. It's not gonna go all my way. But it could be a new way, not tied to personal, but something that's really effective action for the team or the company, whatever, and really presence if this is not personal, right?
It's not, you are bad, I'm good. You're incompetent, I'm competent. Everybody's wrong. I got something to defend, right? Because the end result is, or the kind of place to look from is this situation is gonna happen anyway, right? So it's not personal. So let's see what we can do to move through this and find something that really supports the company and our overall goals. And it may not be that I get everything I want and you get everything you want.
Kristiana Corona
I'm imagining there's people who have scenarios that they need to handle where there's leaders above them that have a conflict and they wanna come in as a mediator or a facilitator into that situation. Does this overall strategy work when there's a power mismatch in the dynamic?
Mills Vautrot: My honest answer is that's kind of situational and what I always try to move forward for is that I absolutely love when there's that power dynamic difference, right? Because it is an opportunity, it's a huge opportunity for both sides, because that one level up, two levels up, whatever executive has the opportunity to build a tremendous amount of trust in the organization through this process.
The issue is, is the executive willing to commit to the process? If they are, there's it's way better, way bigger opportunity than if it's just two peers. Because the two peers will solve their problem and have an impact for the company and, and do all that, but it may not spread too far past those guys.
But if an executive steps in and has that same process and presences, hey, the ETE can be trusted. They actually want to work with you. They actually are interested in what matters to you, and that ripples through the whole organization.
Kristiana Corona
All right, cool. Let's, let's move to the L, which is listen and learn more. Tell me about that one.
Mills Vautrot
When you're digging for gold, the first thing you have to do is clear away the surface of. You know, digging down when you're digging down to get the pirate's chest full of gold, right? The first thing you have to do is get the surface stuff out of the way. That's what the listen and learn part of it is, because many times the real thing is not the surface stuff, but you need to have a process where you go through the uncovering of the surface, you listen, you know?
What's important? What outcome are you looking for when you know when this X action, whatever it is that's perceived as disruptive occurs? What is important to you about that? You know, and then really stop talking and listen what like they need for this process to work, to feel heard early in the process.
Wow. Okay. So use, you know, if you, the listener can't keep your mouth shut and you keep wanting to defend, the process is not gonna work, you might as well stop. That's your first sign that you're not committed to the process. I mean, not you're, you're not bad, but you're not there yet in the process.
Clearly there's still some more completing work to be done. There's still some more letting go of stuff work to be done because your job is to sit. Listen and learn what is the issue. You're gonna let them finish. You're gonna make notes and just hear them. That's what you do to start.
Kristiana Corona
Is it fair to say that at some point in time, after you've been doing Sherlock Holmes for a little while, and you think there's a story there to articulate, here's what I think the story is.
Mills Vautrot
Absolutely. And that's what the A section is. So then A is. You say it back to them, Hey man, here's what I'm hearing that you're saying. Here's what I'm kind of understanding. You are not saying, Hey. Alright, so what you said was. No, that's that you're not, you know, we're human, we're not gonna get it word for word.
And people are already kind of emotional when they're trying to expose this part of getting to that process with you, which is again, something you absolutely have to respect. It's one of the most bravest things people can do these days is to actually step into that situation and have the courage to express what's really there.
And so that, that it deserves a tremendous amount of respect. But you're saying, Hey. Did I hear accurately that you want this outcome and that you're having difficulty with this, or you don't know how to get that result within that timeframe because these things are blocking you and that what's important to you is that you have this kind of outcome in this kind of timeline and this kind, or whatever it is your best to kind of give them back and even articulate it, the things they couldn't articulate.
See it and feel like you're really kind of there, and you do it and with full expectation that they're going to correct you, right? That they're correcting you. Is them engaging in the process? Maybe they say, absolutely. That's it, man. Wow. You got it. You can see them. My whole body kind of relaxed, like somebody heard me or they'll say, eh, you know, whatever.
That there may be a little bit of defending or a little bit of, of just kind of, it makes them feel more comfortable to have a little more control right here. So, no, no, no. That's not what I, I, what I meant was, and that they may explain back something that's like, you know, it's a millimeter off of what you were saying, but they got hurt.
They now know that somebody hurt them and they, and they got to say their piece again.
Kristiana Corona
It's a nice way for them to do a reality check as well. And I feel like it's really similar with coaching where it sounds like at this stage you're not solutioning, you're not telling them. Well that's great to know 'cause now I have the answer and I'm gonna tell it to you.
It's literally be a mirror reflect. Share back what you heard. Did I get it right? Be able to be corrected. Be okay with being wrong. Maybe you missed something. And that's it. That's it. At this stage, you're not moving into I know how to solve this.
Mills Vautrot
Yeah, you are absolutely not trying to move into, I know how to solve it. And oppositely, you wanna be super gracious, grateful, supportive. So when they say, no, no, that's not what I was saying at all. They say back to you and they say it, and maybe it's not what you were saying at all, man. You're like, thank you. Oh my God, I don't know how. I couldn't have heard that. Or maybe it's precisely what they said, and you say, Thank you.
I don't know how I could have missed that. And then you kind of get to the point where you like, so you've said it and you say it back to them again. Right? If they challenge anything that you said, you hear them say it and then say it back. So now they know you heard them, and then you pause, and now it's their turn.
So you their turn to listen, their turn to learn, their turn to explore. If they have that capability set and interest in whatever, and their turn to accurately reflect back. And now depending on their expertise and their training in that, their capacity for doing those three things are gonna be whatever they are.
And it's our job as leaders to just be super graceful, super gracious with it, and just kind of be like. If there's anything that's really off, then you need to correct it. Just like you know, and, and respectfully, and you know, and all of that 'cause you are partnering, going through something, and you've gotta have the courage to keep your weight out of the room.
Right? That gravitas that, well, I'm the boss so, you know, I know you may think it's that way, but no, because moving that, removing that friction will make a big difference over time. So you support them in doing that process and you get to the end of both having feel like you've been given a chance to speak, you have been proven that you've been heard by the personally reflecting, and then you can go to the next, next step.
Kristiana Corona
So if I hear you correctly, this, in essence is you role modeling how to show up for this conversation. Well, you have been maybe more trained or given the questions or practiced more than someone else, but it doesn't mean that the other person can't part. On the other side, listen and reflect and whatever.
Even if they don't do it well, or even if they've never done it before, it sounds like it still can be effective because you sort of started by role modeling it and then when you flip it to them, they've got a little bit more to work with or they've, they kind of know what to expect and so even if they, they, they're terrible.
The behaviors and the expectation of how to communicate with each other are there.
Mills Vautrot
Yes, absolutely. That is exactly it. And. What's beautiful about it is you really see their commitment in the process, right? It's a, there's so much gold in this process. It's not just resolving the conflict. It's how committed are they to resolving the.
Or do you be incredibly gracious, and when it's their turn, they just spit at you, and they kind of like you challenge everything, and you know, do all this stuff. And it's like from, that's okay, because that may be the training that they're at. From where do they do that? Do they do that from just being defended, and they shouldn't, you know, rolling their eyes about being in the room in the first place, or they do it from, this is the skillset that I have right now, but I really want this to outcome.
I really do. I'm excited in my own way, in my own expression. I'm excited to be here, and I really want this, and this is the best I know how to do. And if you can watch through that and really kind of honor the commitment that you see in them, it's amazing. Like, wow, he's coach, and you figure out pretty quickly, is he coachable or is he not?
You find someone who's coachable with commitment. It's worth every second you spend in the room.
Kristiana Corona
I love that. And an example that comes to mind that I've seen in other lives has been teaching people how to do basic research, where we've got researchers who are excellent, they're top of their craft, they know exactly what questions to ask, how to lead someone through an interview without being leading, without telling them too much.
You get just the right essence. However, you know, teaching other people who are not trained researchers how to do basic research can be so empowering, and they can continue to learn from the experts, but then they can continue to understand the importance of, what am I trying to gather here? What types of questions can I be asking?
And it's just that constant refinement process. And suddenly you have an army of people who are obsessed with the customer who are learning about the customer in their everyday interactions. They're asking better questions, they're digging into that level of curiosity, or maybe they wouldn't before because they have that empowerment in those tools.
And so I love this idea that, you know, even if someone is terrible at this, even if I'm terrible at this and I go in and practice it, but the more people that get exposed to it and start adopting this over time, you create a culture of conflict resolution.
Mills Vautrot
Absolutely. And that's one of the things we'll talk about in a second is I don't wanna get, I don't wanna keep, keep us on track for going through the pieces, but there's a part there I really wanna talk about.
So then we've done LE and A and we're now up to D, right? For D, it really is the partnership part of the conversation. Okay. I now know as much as I think I'm gonna know about who you are in this process, what's important to you, what the friction points of friction are. You know what mine are and my concerns.
I know your concerns. Okay, now come on my side of the table and let's look at this and go, how do we fix this? How do we, what are we gonna do? It's fixable. There is a result here. And now you start coming up with ideas. You basically do a brainstorming session, right? That keeps focused on what is that achieved outcome.
What are we trying to accomplish? What's gonna work for both of us? Let's come up with a game plan. And it may be that in that first meeting, you end at the discovery phrase, and then you both kind of with a commitment of, okay, we've picked these two or three, we think these are our best shots. Let's go back and do a little more work on that.
How would we implement these? How would we do that? You know, that's a, we've done a lot of great work. If that's where you stop, fantastic.
Kristiana Corona
I assume that at some stages there's gonna be teams that need to be involved, where it's like, these are some actual ideas that we came up with. Now, let's go back and validate with the teams who are the experts of how to actually implement this stuff. You know, is this doable? Right?
Mills Vautrot
Yeah. But if it's something that, yeah, it goes, it falls across three different departments because the friction is. It. He's not producing the result because there's four chains back that are not producing the result. Then yeah, you need to pull other people in and you, but you see that now you've cleared that area, you've understood that there's pieces and parts, and you'd kind of take a little time to figure out how that would work.
And if we need to have other people in the room, great, we'll have a meet with other people in the room. And once you, and then, so that's the evaluate process. It's really getting down to what is the thing that we all agree is going to be it. And then when you've gotten to the point where you say, okay, that's it.
We think that's it. The question to ask is, okay, if this was already in place, completely working, would we have had the same problem that occurred? And you have to expect that the answer is yes, there's gonna be a decent chip percentage, that the answer is no. It would've never occurred. This is perfect.
But you have to expect that the answer's gonna be yes there. It would've happened anyway, because that question puts them in this mindset of, okay, well wait, hang on. So if we really implemented that, I mean, it sounds really great, but that department, there's just, I don't believe they're gonna, it would do this and this would, you gotta get them living in it with that question and, and from living in it, they're going to say, oh.
I completely, no, it would still happen. Well, why? Well, 'cause I, there's this bottleneck I didn't see until right now when I actually kind of put, got myself in that moment.
Kristiana Corona
So there's a moment here where I love that question. You're allowing people to live through. The experience. Imagining the experience and then saying like, what did we miss?
Like, okay, we thought we covered everything, but actually, now that we're thinking through it, nope, this problem would still happen because of X, Y, or Z. So then once they do that evaluation and maybe they come up with a couple of gaps, then do you just continue to use that to refine your solution?
Mills Vautrot
Absolutely. We roll back to the discovery phrase, okay, here's these gaps. We found them. Great shoulder to shoulder again and whatever, and now we can involve anybody else whose accountability falls inside of that gap and say, this is the gap we're trying to resolve. You're gonna be, we're not gonna come in and tell you, oh, by the way, we figured out your problem for you now do it.
Because they have no ownership of it whatsoever. They're gonna have to change something. They need to be part of that conversation. So we fall back into discovery. We do more brainstorming. Then move through evaluation. Ask the question again, and if the answer is no, if all of these things were in place, would this have happened?
This problem have happened if the answer is no, great, now we go to the R section, right? The last one where we've created a structure, people have kind of lived into that structure to see if it's actually gonna flow. We've made the adjustments that we need to make now. We need to put a structure in place that's gonna allow it to continue, which means there's gonna be requests that need to be made, right?
And so we make those requests for future action, right? I need you to do this, I need you to be done that way, you know? And it's take this action in this timeframe, et cetera. And then we set up a schedule over the next two and a half, three months. We'll meet every other week. Make sure that as we implement and as we move this new process or change process into the organization, that it doesn't start blowing stuff up.
We don't get to just declare, spike the football, go to Disneyland. Now we go to implementation and we check back every, whatever schedule makes sense. It could be weekly, it could be every other week, whatever schedule makes sense for the people involved. They get to make that decision. Everybody does together.
And then okay, maybe there's a little bit of tweaking here and there, but within a very short period of time, you're there.
Kristiana Corona
So I'm curious, do you have an example of a story within an organization that you could tell that sort of talks about the value that they got from using this framework, and you know how that changed? The way things were within their organization moving forward.
Mills Vautrot
Sure. We were doing work with a division of a energy sector, engineering and construction firm. Right. And so they were tasked with building this massive gas plant, and it was not going well. So they brought us in to do some of this work. And you know what became very apparent very quickly was that you had the construction.
So the guys out in the field swinging hammers and you know, building stuff and moving giant pieces of equipment around and doing all that. And you had the engineering, the guys in the office with the cubicles and the pencils, and they're calculating all the pieces and parts and how does this gigantic thing all come together, and what's size, strength, steel, and all that.
And boy did they have zero trust, and the project is. I'm not saying it's failing, but it's not doing as great as they could be, not by any stretch of imagination. So we got basically the leaders of those two teams together to say, so what is it that's not working? Because there's just so much conflict, there's so much friction, and at the end of the day, both sides had a dignity issue.
So the requests weren't around. Well, the quest sounded like, well, you're not giving me the plans the way I need them and you're not, well, you're not telling me how to, you're not speaking to me about what's actually needed in this blah, blah, blah. It's part of the construction and Yeah, but the problem was you hand me stuff like, I must be stupid 'cause I'm just construction and you're the big engineer and the engineers were you.
Every time you talk to me, you're like some hunt 200-pound beach guy on a Lou Weakling and. Once we got them to see that and we got them to communicate, and quite frankly these, this part of finding the, you know, the evaluation, what's gonna fix this, right? What's gonna make the change? It can take so many different forms because in this one, the real move, the needle moment was we said, great, we're doing a barbecue.
Everybody comes, it's Friday afternoon. Everybody, mandatory participation, and engineers, go sit down with a space between each seat. Do not sit with anyone in your department, 'cause they're multi, you know, look, your click your, your little whatever for the, for that team. Do not sit with your team. Put a space in between for every seat construction guys, fill in the spaces.
Do not sit with your team and a couple hours later and a ridiculous amount of barbecue and. These guys were actually talking. They're like, wait, you, you like the cowboys too? You know, you like, you know, whatever. This, the Yankees. Your daughter is a cheerleader. Mine's a cheerleader. You know, your son is, you know, whatever.
My kid loves that show, you know? And oh my God, your 3-year-old kept you all up all night. Oh God, I remember how that was. And they actually started talking, and it turns out neither side was the devil. And, and they. Move that needle so far that they finished the job 20% ahead of schedule and the company profited $35 per man hour, which is somewhere in the, I'm thinking well into eight figures of what they expected to spend and didn't because they finished that much sooner and it was a barbecue.
Yeah, it was, find a way to have them. Not be able to sit in their own little cliques and roll their eyes at the other people, but have to communicate with them. And then another one, you know, one of the things that we find as a theme across all of this a lot of different times is it's not the, you can't do this and I can't do that, and they won't give me this paperwork.
And I, it's dignity. The theme is dignity across almost every major issue. I don't feel like I'm being heard. I don't feel like I'm being respected from blood, sweat, and tears that I'm providing. I feel like I'm being spoken down to in some form or fashion. Whether they are or not doesn't really matter, but that's the kind of theme that falls across it.
We work with a home services company, this really large tree trimming company, and they were about to have a walkout of the field team, and just was like, we're done. Done. I can't put up with this anymore. And because there was a perceived compensation issue and because the work structure with management, and lo and behold, it was dignity.
There really wasn't a compensation issue. They just didn't understand how the inside folks were compensated versus how they were compensated. 'cause they had a very unique compensation structure. Almost everybody inside and outside were on commission. It was like the company, like the owner, was a genius.
He basically said, the more work we get done, the more you get paid. And here's how we're gonna structure that, and this is what it looks like. And then. After having done that for a long time, he wanted some time off from the company. The folks he hired to manage from the inside just weren't used to that way of operating and they weren't communicating clearly about certain things.
And when we sat 'em all down, we made sure that the outside understood that they were being paid fairly. The inside understood what wasn't working, 'cause they were trying to change the old ways that were brilliant and didn't need to be changed. And everybody kind of heard each other. They took a year where they were failing to meet year-on-year numbers and increased it by 10% in the last, through the last four and a half, five months of the year. I mean, they really knocks and work out.
Kristiana Corona
Interesting. Yeah. It just shows that the power of having these tools and to kind of nip it in the bud early to be able to figure out, you know, diagnose what is actually happening here, can save. Weeks or months of frustration, inefficiency, wasted time, wasted work, people quitting, like all of those downstream impacts of the length of time that you sit and struggle, that all of that can be shortened or maybe even, in some cases, eliminated.
Mills Vautrot
Right? Absolutely. And what's really great is that what we see, you know, kind of like what's the long term? Like, okay, we got that problem solved. Alright, great. We have another problem Tomorrow. Our business has problems, you know, and business is doing good. So what is it that is the result of this? It builds organizational trust when people know that when something's not working, really not working, and it matters that it works.
Right. Because I mean, let's be realistic. Some of the stuff is like, eh, you know, we can operate around that. It's not that big of a deal and we can't, you know, not every single nuance is gonna be dealt with, right? But when they know that if it matters, there's a process that they can go through. There are people who understand the process and who engage and encourage the process.
Then they feel like, okay, my concerns matter. That leads to a discretionary effort, right? It's, you wanna get six days of productivity for five days of pay. Teach people that you, it matters what they think. That the organization is structured to be trustworthy in the fact that if they, we say, if you've got a problem, bring it to us.
We wanna get it resolved that you do every time. And they're more efficient, they're more effective, they're more creative, they're happier, they're more collaborative. At the end of the day, they're healthier, they have a more balanced life, and they're more available. To seize opportunities around them that support the company.
Kristiana Corona
There's really no downside. There's no downside. That's incredible. I'm just hearing you say the list of those things gives me chills, you know, like the power that one person can have to start this new way of handling conflict within an organization and, and that over time that could be the result. That's incredible.
Mills Vautrot
It's incredible. And in fact, you know, just one quick aside, the engineering company that I was talking about. Really took this on, saw the value of it, said, listen, the president of the division told everybody, if you see something that's not working or you see a big change that could impact the company, like really make a difference for us.
Use your channels and move it through. If for any reason you feel like that's just not, it's not getting through, it's not, then come see me. Now, we've had presidents and CEOs say that before. And all the frontline staff roll their eyes and go, yeah, I'm gonna walk into his office. Really? You know, you gotta be kidding me.
I'm gonna trump my way off the field with my muddy boots and whatever, and I'm gonna walk into his, you know? Really? Yeah. And he did the work to make that real. And one of the frontline guys, young guy, probably with the company only like less than two years, saw something. I didn't try to move it through channels.
I didn't actually move properly. Said, okay, well he said, so went up to the his office and said, can we talk? And he's like, Al, you know, great guy too. The president was great guy, 'cause I mean, he was busy and he looked up and went, this is how I make my mark. This is what I do to have people believe me, really?
And said, sure, come on in. And that conversation saved them hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars, but it would never have happened. If they hadn't built the trust inside the organization, that one, we're willing to support solving problems. And two, we mean it when we say, come bring me your good ideas.
Kristiana Corona
Yeah. Oh, I love that. That's so cool. So just to recap again the steps of this process and then I think we gotta wrap up. The, the be the leader process for conflict resolution is to be prepared. To make sure that you figure out how to both come to the table at with your senses and to understand, and then to listen and do that reflection exercise where you're gathering information, you're, you're really hearing what their needs are and then being able to explore and, and look at what are the consequences if this broke down, if we don't fix this, what might happen?
Really being able to summarize that effectively and say, did I get it right? And then being able to flip roles. Someone else does it back. So they again, listen to you, they reflect what they heard, and then you go into this collaborative discovery process where you're really trying to identify what are some of the standards that have been violated or the values or the deep down the, the center of that onion.
The treasure chest, uh, have we found it of, of needs so that you can co-create a new solution that works for both parties. And then after that there's this request, there's this future action that is committed to, and then some kind of accountability and check-ins. Did I get that right?
Mills Vautrot
Almost. It's so close. So once we do the discovery where it's basically brainstorming, then we do the evaluation where we. Figure out which one it is and pick the one that we're saying is going to be the thing, and then move through that process of does it really work? This one we picked, and then we go to the requests and put the structure in place to have it be to sustainable and to keep going.
Kristiana Corona
I love it. So if people are interested in doing a conflict resolution workshop or learning more about this from you, what would be a next step? How would they?
Mills Vautrot
You can find me on LinkedIn, so you can always catch me that way. And the company phone number is (713) 446-8700. And Strategic Change Partners is a part of another company called the Leadership and Performance Company, but that's a lot to type.
So what we normally do, what we set it up for is that my business partner's website sends you straight there, right? So we got a little bit of our own layer of onions here, but it makes sense once you're in the process. Just trust me. Uh, sopattyshull.com. P-A-T-T-Y-S-H-U-L-L.com.
Kristiana Corona
Patti was on the podcast, uh, recently, and was able to talk to us a little bit more about virtuosity and kind of going from being an expert to a virtuoso. So I know that we've provided that link before, and we'll provide it again here. Both of you guys have. Different workshops, different things that you offer through that program, but your business in particular is the strategic change, right?
Mills Vautrot
Right. Yeah. That's kind of one of my specialty areas. I also work hand in hand with Patty for the change management leadership development of different types and a number of other things that you can see on the site.
And you know, we can be brought in to serve as a third party to kind of mediate and bring this process to the company. We also have a process that we can take people through that certifies them in doing this.
Kristiana Corona
Oh, very cool. I didn't know that.
Mills Vautrot
Yeah, so if there's, you know, change management type things, we know we'll facilitate steering committees, we'll do communications, we'll support OKR designs and all that kind of stuff. But for the conflict stuff. This is what our process looks like.
Kristiana Corona
I love that you have multiple options because I think for some people they might say like, okay, that sounds like a lot. I would wanna bring in an expert and have them handle this. You know, for my business I wanna have it just handled right.
But then for others who are kind of practitioners who really like to learn new things, new techniques, you know, new certifications, things like that, it's great that you have that toolkit. The process for training that you can start to create more and more of these ambassadors, um, who can do this. I love that.
Well, it's been such a pleasure to have you on. Thank you for talking through this conflict resolution path. I think it's really, really helpful for people to know that there are tool sets out there that they can use beyond maybe just their lived experience or maybe, you know, they're feeling jaded at how things are going in the company and you think, oh, that'll never change.
But honestly, it can, and there's tool sets that are really effective and have been proven over decades to be able to solve these kinds of problems. So I really appreciate you walking through that, giving us new ideas, new perspectives and, and tools to be able to work through.
Mills Vautrot
Awesome. Thanks so much for having me. I love doing this kind of stuff. It's just a total joy for me. I really appreciate the opportunity today.
Kristiana Corona
Awesome. Thank you.
